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Post by gliptitude on Apr 23, 2016 22:22:21 GMT -5
I just discovered Subterranea for the 2600, after seeing it on some game lists. I've been playing it off of the flash cart for a few days.
I think this is a really excellent game! It will probably make it into my top 10 for the console. The gameplay is dynamic and diverse, the sprites are awesome and the whole thing is really well scaled for the system, in my opinion. The game gets pretty challenging pretty quickly but everything functions soundly and it never really seems unfair to me. There are some bizarre and abstract qualities and I think the game really creates a distinct mood.
Based on how i've seen other people describe other games, I'm guessing that other people associate Subterranea with Defender, and consider the game to be inspired by Defender. Well it has some things in common but it is definitely a lot different, with boss battles and vertical scroll between levels. I think the whole concept is worked out well and completely and it ends up being a really unique game for the VCS. I'm surprised I didn't know the title until last week.
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Post by TrekMD on Apr 23, 2016 22:34:08 GMT -5
Yes, this is a fun game for the system. I can see why folks would compare it to Defender but the gameplay is different enough.
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Post by VectorX on Apr 23, 2016 22:38:28 GMT -5
^It's not a real common cartridge, being released the year the video game crash started. Things were going all to hell at that point and that could be why it got overlooked. (EDIT: this was supposed to be a response to glip's last sentence, but Trek beat me to the post.) I just got into this one myself in the last year via trade. I agree with pretty much everything you said. It's been nice to be able to finally play something I had been interested in for over 20 years, as I have a review of it from an old video game mag and it sounded cool (plus it was created by Imagic...good guys there  ). A simple concept with increasing difficulty and a variety of enemies. |
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Post by sj on Apr 24, 2016 2:40:47 GMT -5
I've got that on a cart. (Currently in a box in the loft wth my other 2600 stuff. Quiet life trade-off with the missus   ) |
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Post by TrekMD on Apr 24, 2016 8:12:31 GMT -5
These are quite rare. Someone is selling repros on Ebay calling them "white label variant."
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Post by 50tbrd on Apr 24, 2016 11:13:28 GMT -5
This game caught my eye and I don't even play the 2600.
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Post by Rapetou33 on Apr 24, 2016 14:30:34 GMT -5
+1
I have no atari 2600 , but I played it on emulator earlier in the day. Astonishing !
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Post by gliptitude on Apr 30, 2016 14:38:41 GMT -5
I have continued playing this all week and pretty much this is the game i'm playing lately, with just a few other Atari games mixed in for variety and breaks. My opinion hasn't changed significantly. I've found a few things that annoy me now but overall the extended play has helped solidify the status of this game for me, very near the very very top of the 2600 list. I just got into this one myself in the last year via trade. I agree with pretty much everything you said. It's been nice to be able to finally play something I had been interested in for over 20 years. VectorX I'm curious to know where you've gotten with the game, seeing as you are a pretty competitive gamer. .. I have only reached the boss at the end of the third level one time and I died almost immediately there. High score around 12,000 I think. Usually I die at the first or second stage of the third level. I am only a little bit motivated to get further in the game. It's a really gratifying play and, (unless i'm really missing out on some later surprises), all of the mechanics and the unique challenges of the game are pretty completely laid out in the first two levels. Really interesting scrolling and enemy movement. .. Some of the difficulty increases are really cool but others seem arbitrary. .. I initially tried the game with very little introduction and not knowing the rules, which i think is a great way to start with this game, to discover it. Playing it this way at first reminded me of 3D Sector X, which is intended to be played this way, like a puzzle. .. I really love shooters, especially unique or flashy ones, but a lot of shooters sort of disproportionately reward perfection and ruthlessly punish error, and i find this to marginally be true in Subterranea. .. I am sort of fantisizing about a more perfect version or just a different version of this game. Also just trying to recognize what is great about it and imagine how it could inform and inspire new games. .. If this a Defender knock off then i think we need tons more knock offs of the great games. |
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Post by VectorX on Apr 30, 2016 15:53:48 GMT -5
VectorX I'm curious to know where you've gotten with the game, seeing as you are a pretty competitive gamer. .. I have only reached the boss at the end of the third level one time and I died almost immediately there. High score around 12,000 I think. Once I get my 2600 hooked back up and playing I'll have to check, but I know I've gotten through a few additional levels. I think my highest has been 18-19,000, maybe not that high. I know I've never hit 20,000. I forget what the highest enemy I've ever gotten to looks like. I do know they bounce up and down pretty high and you can scroll that level a little bit, as the playfield has gotten fairly large by then. I need to do a certain project off a Sega CD game, then disconnect that and get the 2600 back going since I have Skeleton+ on the way, my very first homebrew for the 2600 .. If this a Defender knock off then i think we need tons more knock offs of the great games. There were only a few back in the day, being Stargunner by Telesys and Killer Satellites for the Supercharger. I wouldn't quite put it in the knock-off category though, aside from controlling your ship and scrolling being very similar. |
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Post by gliptitude on May 1, 2016 11:31:29 GMT -5
Oh no rush on that. I was just curious. But i guess you'll be set up for it soon anyway for that first homebrew. .. I did actually get a bit deeper into the third end boss since last post, but still couldn't beat it. .. The homing enemies get more difficult and intelligent, which is cool, but the number of them also goes up which i find pretty annoying. I think they call that "grinding" these days.
.. I was kind of being sarcastic when I called Subterranea a Defender knock-off. We already discussed it a bit earlier in the thread. But it does seem to be the default profile of this game. When i search "subterranea atari" the first non-video search result on google is the game page on AtariAge. The short description of the game there uses the word DEFENDER five times. Also says towards the end:
"While Subterranea borrows concepts from other games and doesn't appear to be very original, there's just something about it that keeps you coming back for yet another game. (Contributed by shadow460)"
It's not a negative review, but the idea that it's not original seems ludicrous to me. .. It reminds me a little bit of when people compare Juno First to Defender and War of the Worlds to Space Invaders. Those aren't meaningless comparisons but I think they detract a little bit from the subsequent games which are really completely inspired.
I learned recently that even the author himself proposed Yars' Revenge as a reinterpretation of Star Castle. Well that's very interesting.
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Post by VectorX on May 1, 2016 12:28:58 GMT -5
Oh no rush on that. I was just curious. But i guess you'll be set up for it soon anyway for that first homebrew. Yeah I need to, since once I get a new game I'll be dropping everything else It'll be good to get back to 2600 stuff though. The homing enemies get more difficult and intelligent, which is cool, but the number of them also goes up which i find pretty annoying. Yeah, you have to try to shoot them, or just move away as quickly as possible when it looks like you're not going to hit them, then repeat. It's just classic "twitch" gaming from Imagic, well known for them back then. The short description of the game there uses the word DEFENDER five times. Also says towards the end: "While Subterranea borrows concepts from other games and doesn't appear to be very original, there's just something about it that keeps you coming back for yet another game. (Contributed by shadow460)" It's not a negative review, but the idea that it's not original seems ludicrous to me. There aren't many games like that PERIOD. Combining the first enemy with shooting the next wave of ones in a different stage, then after that you have gates to go through in between their beams? Doesn't sound like anything else I've played a lot of at all. I don't see a War of the Worlds/Space Invaders link at all. There were tons more invaders in Invaders than what you have to face in Worlds. I learned recently that even the author himself proposed Yars' Revenge as a reinterpretation of Star Castle. Well that's very interesting. Actually that's what people have said for years, that it was conceived as a reverse clone of Star Castle. Don't know if that's true or not, but well done by Atari if so. I never would've figured that out myself in a million years if no one had said that. |
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Post by gliptitude on May 1, 2016 13:33:06 GMT -5
Actually that's what people have said for years, that it was conceived as a reverse clone of Star Castle. Don't know if that's true or not, but well done by Atari if so. I never would've figured that out myself in a million years if no one had said that. Yeah i heard it before but always kind of disagreed with it. Then i watched this really cool video where Howard Scott Warshaw talks about it himself: www.gdcvault.com/play/1021865/Classic-Game-Postmortem-YarsHe gives a lot of interesting information and ideas in this presentation. |
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