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Post by 50tbrd on Dec 27, 2013 18:27:47 GMT -5
Not to many games utilized the light pen. Some of the original light pen games really only minimally use it for the program. No one has made a homebrew light pen program so far. So I thought we could throw a few ideas out there and see if it inspired anyone. Missile Command (Patriots) could be interesting with a light pen function. Also, this is a very simple type of program that could probably be done using the light pen. scratch.mit.edu/projects/1066911/ |
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Post by 50tbrd on Dec 27, 2013 18:30:11 GMT -5
I was also thinking that even though you cannot use an overlay with a light pen game on the Vectrex itself, I guess you could use one on emulation. That is if I can ever figure out how to make custom overlays work on ParaJVE....
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Post by VECTORGOD on Dec 27, 2013 20:43:15 GMT -5
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Post by VECTREXER on Dec 28, 2013 2:54:34 GMT -5
Wack-A-Mole!
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Post by wyldephang on Dec 28, 2013 3:14:11 GMT -5
Last year, I proposed that the Light Pen could be used in an Angry Birds homebrew for the Vectrex. Drag the birds into the right position and release the button to send them careening into a stack of boxes, nabbing high scores in the process. I think this kind of gameplay suits the Vectrex well.
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Post by VECTREXER on Dec 28, 2013 14:27:32 GMT -5
I was also thinking that even though you cannot use an overlay with a light pen game on the Vectrex itself, I guess you could use one on emulation. That is if I can ever figure out how to make custom overlays work on ParaJVE.... Well certainly not the standard overlay. But what about a surface cling overlay? The distance to the screen should allow for this kind of overly to work well. But only if the overlay conforms well to the screen and is not blocking access to the screen by being too opaque. |
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Post by gliptitude on Dec 28, 2013 17:21:38 GMT -5
I am a big fan of the light pen and I have used it extensively to make animations, (which I take video of with a separate camera). I put together a fairly detailed Vectrex game pitch this way.
.. BUT -
I really don't like the light pen for gaming. .. The new Mail Plane ROM is fun, but I would much prefer it if the game did NOT use the light pen.
As mentioned, it pretty much eliminates the possibility of an overlay, which is a huge loss in my opinion. Also it is a distraction from the graphics on the screen, which I would much rather have a clear and comfortable sight of at all times.
But more importantly than that, it is just completely at odds with the button/stick/pad controls that are so gratifying to play games with. The implementation of this device in a game is not (in itself) fun for me, and if a "light pen game" is good, (like Mail Plane) it is IN SPITE of the light pen.
.. I can more easily imagine a MOUSE doing the same thing more effectively, and in a less disruptive way.
xxxxx
All of that being said, I would love LOVE to see a more robust animation program on cartridge for Vectrex. "Animation Master" perhaps. If someone could make an animation program with all or most of the features that I desire, it would CERTAINLY be my number one most coveted Vectrex item. Also, I think there are enough variables to justify this being MULTIPLE CARTRIDGES, perhaps able to interface in some way with each other, via some sort of saving option. (If actual file saves are impractical, there are still other options, such as a text display mode that would identify all of the coordinates etc, for you to copy down on paper and then re-enter later).
Both Animaction and the animation function of Art Master are very useful and gratifying to play with if you put the time in. They also both provide (in a very direct way) what I consider to be a very unique method of animation, because of the vector graphics.
Animaction of course has more features and allows for more complex animations. But the method in Art Master is rigorously different, even from how animation is typically conceived in most Vectrex games - basically a "morphing" function from one frame to the next. The effect of this can be very beautiful and it is also a an interesting challenge, sustaining each and every coordinate in sequence from frame to frame.
I don't think a new Vectrex animation cart would have to have a ton of features to be a worthwhile project. There are many many different features that would be cool to see, but there is a small handful that would be most essential.
For me the most important, and possibly also the simplest to implement, would be THE ABILITY TO MANUALLY ENTER COORDINATES for the vertices in Art Master. If you were able to freehand with the light pen, exactly as you are already able to do, but then also be able to adjust your work very precisely - THAT ALONE WOULD BE A HUGE IMPROVEMENT.
.. The other obvious improvements would be the ability to save work, the ability to produce longer animations, the ability to use the Art Master morphing technique in Animaction and the ability to work on a PC and export to the cart for display on Vectrex. .. Lots of other little things that I won't describe, but that anyone who has spent much time with either game would recognize as improvements.
.. On the other hand though probably a more useful and more easily devised Vectrex animation program would be one that entirely and exclusively ran on a PC, and produced a flashable .BIN of your animation for viewing on Vectrex and sharing with others. THAT WOULD BE SWEET.
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Post by 50tbrd on Dec 28, 2013 18:36:51 GMT -5
Quantum seems like it'd be an awesome game to play on the Vectrex, especially if you could use a light pen, trackball or mouse. gliptitude, I think the key to making a good Light Pen game for the Vectrex, is making it as unobtrusive as possible. The controls need to be as solely linked to the Light Pen as possible, meaning that touching the screen not only shows the position but also activates a function - "Fire at this point", "move to this point", "use this circled object or area". Either that or build buttons into the pen itself. I know that a trackball has been used with the Vectrex, has a mouse ever been used for it? kokovecI support development for the Vectrex no matter what program or game you are working on but Mail Plane is the first program to use the Light Pen in a way that makes it essential to GAMERS. Animaction, Art Master, and Melody Master really aren't pick up and PLAY games. They take some figuring out, reading the manual and a significant time to feel gratified. I think it could really use some development that supports a drive to acquire a Light Pen for than just collecting/completist reasons or for the learning/development purposes that were originally motivated/ that you've demonstrated effectively. |
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Post by VectorX on Dec 28, 2013 18:42:59 GMT -5
I know that a trackball has been used with the Vectrex, has a mouse ever been used for it? kokovecExactly, he made one  |
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Post by kokovec on Dec 30, 2013 12:33:53 GMT -5
Yes.
Actually the trackball was a PS/2 type device.
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Post by hcmffm on Dec 30, 2013 16:23:42 GMT -5
Not to many games utilized the light pen. ... Simple games could be fun with the light pen. A longer time ago my wife played "Hammer" in an arcade in Italy. Gameplay was very simple: With a **plastic hammer** hammer on the insects and pests that try to eat your food or do other harm. |
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Post by gliptitude on Dec 30, 2013 21:09:54 GMT -5
It would have to be a very special game and a very special concept for the light pen to really work well for it. .. I believe that GCE originally promoted it as a learning tool, and I think that that is still the most natural use for it. .. And when you look at the subsequent 30 years of gaming, there is not much indication that light pens were useful for playing games. Perhaps the DS stylus is something similar, but very very few games use this in a satisfying way. .. Meanwhile graphic display tablets have become quite common in animation studios, and Art Master offered something similar to that.
IDK. Maybe a tower defense type strategy game might make sense, so you could quickly place items anywhere on screen. Or another kind of strategy game, since the action is less immediate than arcade games, and you could afford to be covering the screen with your hand half the time.
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Post by VECTREXER on Jan 6, 2014 17:45:29 GMT -5
Flamin' Finger. As a lightpen game this should be suitably challenging, and frustrating, at the same time. As long as a method for drawing enough lines and dots exists.
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Post by 50tbrd on Feb 6, 2014 0:09:44 GMT -5
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Post by binarystar on Feb 6, 2014 5:11:34 GMT -5
Jim (Marblemad) made a lightpen with a button on it. The prototype Vectrex lightpen had a button but was removed for the released version. I've done some preliminary coding for a homebrew lightpen game, I was thinking a reflex/judgement test game like 'Point Blank' would work well.
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