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Post by VectorX on Aug 5, 2013 18:57:33 GMT -5
the rest of you guys seem pretty layed back, cool headed, straight thinking individuals which is reassuring:) Glad you noticed  Until the *other* fight on here happened, I had said several times I was surprised of how little arguing we've ever had on here. No one's self-deleted their account, nor been banned (again, not counting spammers). Thanks- im just really surprised by some of the "clutching at straws" comments that he has made which are pretty hard to defend ,I never expected it to evoke to that kind of response to be honest, You have to look at both sides of this. One--and what was obvious right off the bat with the very first post on here--that your product was so closely named after the original. People were wondering if it had anything to do with the original Vectorcade, which I'm sure Brett felt a bit slighted that it was so closely named to his product, and even looks quite a bit like it at first glance. And obviously the other side is that people are taken aback by the price, most of us are just looking of it as to being a game controller, whereas you think it's closer to art and justly priced (although feel free to correct if I'm not wrapping this up correctly). Rather than go into any more details and who should do what next, I just hope that you would post some other Vectrex-related stuff if you're really that much of a Vectrex nut Same goes for Brett, as he's been around forever in the scene, yet I don't really know anything about him. |
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Post by Mayhem on Aug 5, 2013 19:07:34 GMT -5
Now, I'm generally staying out of the argument per se, but I believe Brett's gripe is not that you've produced a new arcade stick for the Vectrex, but that it is remarkably similar to his design. You could have come up with any shape, look and feel, but it's a copy of the Vectorcade. The shape is similar, the colours and finish are similar, there's a big Vectrex logo on the front, the placement of the joystick and buttons is similar... I can't comment on the internals as I haven't seen them. But if you put both side by side, a lot of people wouldn't really grasp the small visible differences that are present. And that's really what the negative comments are about. Brett, feel free to correct me here if I'm actually wrong.
Fair play that you've sold a few at the price you're asking, because I don't think you'll get a lot of business sadly. Having been in the Vectrex scene for 15 years, I'd like to think I have a good grasp about the market, and it's notoriously cheap hah hah... only a few big spending collectors such as myself really went out for the top dollar items.
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Post by hcmffm on Aug 6, 2013 1:51:48 GMT -5
Thanks- im just really surprised by some of the "clutching at straws" comments that he has made which are pretty hard to defend ,I never expected it to evoke to that kind of response to be honest,the rest of you guys seem pretty layed back, cool headed, straight thinking individuals which is reassuring:) odd77, your perspective of things is wrong: Not sure about other people here, but I'm not laid back. Have a look at the long personal mail that I've sent to you yesterday and you can see this. What we try to do here in this public forum is handling a pretty bad situation in a fair way. Also I have the impression that my personal mail to you didn't make you realize, so here in other words, again: Fact is: A replica of a rare Vectrex product has been generated without permission of the original creator. The creator of the original stated that he does not want his design to be copied and that you should create your own design. You continue and write as if nothing happened and as if you have created something new, speaking even of art. This is definitely not the case, it's a design copy which can be clearly seen looking at the two blue controllers. Adding some stickers does not make a new design. Please note that I don't have Vectorcade and would want one. But noone here wants your Vectrex controller under the current conditions. odd77, please cancel your ebay auction and sort things out; things that you should have sorted out before making your Vectrex controller sales public. Thank you. |
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odd77
Vector Runner
As Basil would say- " Dont mention the war ! "
Posts: 22 
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Post by odd77 on Aug 6, 2013 4:52:54 GMT -5
I firstly have to apologies for not seeing your message - Im completly new to this forum and still finding my feet,so you'll have to excuse me not responding to it.
Now to the issue in hand -I do not wish to argue any more about this as it is clear that many other have grasped the rational of what I am doing and are happy to move on- on the other hand there (as in most cases in life) the minority who dont like change and want to live in the past.
We all have a lot of respect for Bret and what he gave to the vectrex community
however world is too large a place to allow one person to try and claim a monopoly over such a thing in such a fashion - I could understand your point of view should the vectorcade ultilize some specific piece of tech or material which he pioneered-but the fact is it doesnt-
The world would be a very underdeveloped place if your attitude had of been adopted towards the the makers of the first car,aeroplane,television,computer,and even games console.
Not that im suggesting that the vectorcade or Vec2cade is in this league - it wont change the world lets be real.
The control console far predates even the oldest member of this site and beyond,as im sure do the the other components used, add to this a logo which now exsits in the public domain - let alone that brett never even used the MB euro logo nor ever expressed any notion for using it- what has he got?
You obliviously have a close connection with Brett and its a very honorable thing you are trying to do for him - but hounding me to remove my original product from ebay goes a bit to far - if you read the listing I clearly state it is "not a vectorcade" and that the other other images are for illustration purposes only and are not for sale!
Finally I think you seem to but making a big assumption in stating that "noone here wants your Vectrex controller under the current conditions" as its not the feedback that im getting - sorry - but as said earlier there are those willing to try new things.And if you or any others dont wish to be involved its fine,but please allow other for have a choice and think for themselves.
But there is one thing you have convinced me of - your definitely are not laid back :)you have my apologies in making that assumption
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Post by VectorX on Aug 6, 2013 8:20:52 GMT -5
but hounding me to remove my original product from ebay goes a bit to far I agree. I don't know much about ebay but it seems to me that she violated no policy of theirs. Sure her controller looks a bit like Brett's, but just because we're all familiar with it doesn't mean she needs to do away with it altogether (Brett made under 50 of those; it's not like hundreds were made) and deprive her clientele of buying it, even if they're not using it for a Vectrex. Again, I can understand why people are upset over this (I wouldn't like it either if I came out with something and then someone came out with something later that looked a lot like it and gave it a very similar name to it), but that shouldn't result in telling people how to run their business just because they don't agree with it. She might as well come to your job and tell you you shouldn't do various things to make money either. |
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Post by 50tbrd on Aug 6, 2013 9:07:43 GMT -5
You started out making a tribute piece and you made a very good replica of the original. Nobody cares when you make one for yourself, nobody cares when you even make a few for others, the problem comes in when you go it to full blown production of a replica especially when it's not only unauthorized but now the original author has disapproved. You could piss off everyone in the world but you don't want to piss off the original creator.
Sell whatever you've got but you can pick any name in the World, don't pick a name that is so close to the original, don't make the design so close to the original, and don't make the layout so close to original. An artist should have no trouble coming up with a different design that incorporates all the same elements and has its own unique personality.
The buttons can be configured differently, the placement of the debossed logo can anywhere, and you've already got that nice 3D Spawn Ship, then just pick a new name.
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Post by sj on Aug 6, 2013 9:38:10 GMT -5
I don't know that they're crippling per se. It may be different for European sellers, eBay listing fees. Then selling... 10% isn't it? Then paypal fees on top. I've come to the conclusion it's a good place to grab a bargain (sometimes) as a buyer, but as a seller, not so appealing. Anyway. Back to the fisticuffs...  |
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Post by gauze on Aug 6, 2013 9:56:11 GMT -5
it's like she did her own version of the mona lisa except mona's now throwing a middle finger at brett w. and might I add  |
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Post by sj on Aug 6, 2013 10:06:11 GMT -5
The buttons can be configured differently, the placement of the debossed logo can anywhere, and you've already got that nice 3D Spawn Ship, then just pick a new name. I'm guessing there is no copyright on Brett's design. Presumably odd77 can do as she pleases. Market forces will decide if it's a winner. |
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odd77
Vector Runner
As Basil would say- " Dont mention the war ! "
Posts: 22
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Post by odd77 on Aug 6, 2013 10:42:43 GMT -5
To take each in turn, "The buttons can be configured differently" ok so I put one around the back,two on the side,one on the front and hey lets have the joystick underneath! No I put them where ergonomics dictates where they should go - 40 years of the video gaming industry has established that - not Brett! "the placement of the debossed logo can anywhere" Again hey lets put it underneath or at the back of the controller - just like Atari,Sega,Nintendo,Sony Microsoft and nearly every other console since the dawn of time have done - oh wait hmmmmmmmm darn see above. Its still baffles me that you cant grasp that its a completely different logo ,which involved as much skill if not more than Bretts ever did ,Show me one a vectorcade that brett ever produced featuring the European MB logo and I'll stand corrected.(and not a photoshoped one! ) As for the name I think its safe to say that most things associated with vector/vectrex tend to involve the term vec ,I like the name, its in use by none else, I came up with it and I wont be changing it As for Bret I get the feeling hes upset because he seems consider that I have rained on in his parade(which was never my intention), instead of embracing that fact that there is someone out there with skill and motivation,willing use it to assist in keeping the vectrex spirit alive, be it even in generating discussion. |
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Post by Mayhem on Aug 6, 2013 10:59:09 GMT -5
Almost every arcade stick I've encountered has the buttons in a shallow arc, to encompass the natural curve of the fingers on the hand. The only one that springs to mind that has them in a straight line is... the Vectorcade. The fact you've copied that aspect, and what appears to be exactly the same joystick parts is a little telling. And that's what I think people are griping about, that in so many ways this product is designed to ape the original Vectorcade and not stand on its own feet, completely apart.
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Post by sj on Aug 6, 2013 11:03:28 GMT -5
^ don't forget the original controller has the buttons in a straight line. sj with his tongue stuck firmly in his cheek...Mayhem, you're just sore cos you've found out the mold you bought has a flaw in it.   |
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Post by playvectrex on Aug 6, 2013 11:10:02 GMT -5
Some more info for you guys: The first 16 Vectorcades were sold for $100. #17 though 26 were $120 to help cover costs of shipping which was underestimated. I was breaking even more or less, as I said profit wasn't my goal. #19 was skipped. #26 was the last numbered one. There was one special edition unit made for the Philly Classic 3 event, sold there. Check out these sweet pictures... and there is a copyright on every Vectorcade
imgur.com/a/Smqrm |
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Post by sj on Aug 6, 2013 11:17:31 GMT -5
... and there is a copyright on every Vectorcade That's interesting. btw. Those Vectorcades with no knobs on. Was that a design error? |
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Post by playvectrex on Aug 6, 2013 11:37:28 GMT -5
... and there is a copyright on every Vectorcade That's interesting. btw. Those Vectorcades with no knobs on. Was that a design error? That's how they come out of the mold, before drilling ;-) |
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Until the *other* fight on here happened, I had said several times I was surprised of how little arguing we've ever had on here. No one's self-deleted their account, nor been banned (again, not counting spammers).
